I had a fascinating discussion with my agent the other day, about the current and future shape of the sci-fi/fantasy genre. In her opinion, the traditional fantasies (in my case: The Hythrun Chronicles, Demon Child and to a lesser extent, the Tide Lords) that have been the mainstay of the genre for decades, are starting to give way to more contemporary fare. The biggest fantasy sellers of the past few years, after all, are about a kid in a magical boarding school and a vegetarian vampire.

Both are set in the 21st century. There’s nary a goat herder sight.

This is not to say that traditional epic fantasy is dead. That sorry fate, according to my agent, belongs to science fiction at the moment, which she can hardly give away, let alone sell for actual money. Unless you’re already “name” or have credentials that stack up against Stephen Hawkins and can write like Harper Lee, it might be wise to shelve that epic Sci-fi opus you’ve been working on, she advises, until the market turns again, as it inevitably will.

But if publishers would prefer contemporary fantasy at the moment (and I can promise you, with the success of Twilight, romance is back, big time) where does that leave writers of the epic genre?

To be honest, probably not starving. Authors with established fanbases will continue to do well (provided they keep producing the goods at a decent standard). Goat herders destined to become princes, peasants who discover they have great magical powers and hapless wizards caught up in the machinations of courts and kings will be with us for a long while yet. New authors trying to break into the market will be struggling more than usual, because publishers are looking for the next Stephanie Meyer, right now, not the next Tolkien. It doesn’t help that the global economy is in the pits, either, making the risk of publishing a new author in a possibly-waning genre a risky proposition.

The obvious solution, you’d think, would be to just bite the bullet and write contemporary stuff. But contemporary fantasy isn’t as easy to write as you might think. Firstly, even before you get to plot or characterisation, you have the problem of where to set it. Stephen King consistently sets his stories in rural Maine, but what of us who don’t live in a place with so many conveniently spooky locations with such an atmospheric climate? What nation should you set your work in? Is the contemporary dialogue of the characters going to be so local nobody understands it? If you set your story in Coonabarabran, will that limit it to the Australian market? If you set it in Mumbai, will only Indians want to read it? (Actually, given the population of India, that may not be a bad thing…hehehe).

Then you have the problem of established authors changing genres. Fans come to expect one thing, and get annoyed when they do something else. Or fans of the new genre resent you because you’re not “one of them”. It is for this reason that if I ever decided to write… oh, I don’t know… say… a cutting expose of inner world of professional wrestling, I probably wouldn’t publish it under the name “Jennifer Fallon”.

The problem is even more complex, because it’s not actually about what’s popular now. It’s about what’s going to be popular two years from now. Realistically, that’s the earliest it’s going to hit the shelves, if you can get your bright idea formulated into a saleable synopsis, written, edited, and published.

If this sounds as if I’m having a tormented internal dialogue about what to write next, it’s not. I have known for over a year what I wanted to do next, and the conversation with my agent was, in some measure, prompted by a sense of relief that my instincts of 18 months ago seem right, and my idea is not about to get overtaken by a rapidly changing market.

What was interesting about the discussion was the sad conclusion that originality is a laudable ambition, it’s not what mega-sells. Twilight is a case in point. Jane Austen’s 18th century heroines are more independent and spunky than Meyer’s Bella, and there’s little originality in her thinly disguised conservative Christian agenda of abstinence and female submission. Harry Potter is a story brilliantly told, using every trope in the fantasy spectrum from orphans through to evil overlords (still don’t know why Voldemort didn’t just use a shotgun to rid himself of those pesky Potters, btw).

And that is what I find endlessly frustrating. Writing successfully (and I am using $$$ here, not critical acclaim, as a way of keeping score) is not always about doing it better. If I can use the analogy of food, it’s not serving up something exotic and new. It’s more about comfort food, packaged to look exotic and new. Underneath the sexy spices sprinkled over your tasty fantasy dish, you’d better have good old meat and three vegies for your audience to sink their teeth into, or you’ll never make it to the menu, let alone have people lining up to try your fabulous recipe.

I try and read some new authors...in ubran fantasy and then 'epic'ish fantasy, I figure they need food too. there are some authors where I read anything they write...your on that list...

Ooooh a cutting expose of the inner world of professional wrestling!! I can't wait, I bet it will be hilarious. Keep us posted. ;)

cool post. quite interesting. the slow demise of epic fantasy. how sad.

I think its a mistake to focus on what is going to be the big next thing. I have been reading fantasy for a gazillion years and have read one Stephanie Meyer book; and yeah it was OK, but I havent rushed out to buy any more. You only have to read fantasy author fan sites to see how indepth the love and passion for epic fantasy is and how deep the fanbase goes. Stephanie, whilst being popular right now, may be a one trick pony and unless she can develop a bit of Anne Rice-ednish, isnt going to hold the limelight for all that much longer. And have you ever logged onto her website and read her dummy spit about someone putting one of her drafts on the internet? I mean, I get how frustrating and pathetic it is for someone to do that and how it hurts an author financially and artistically; but by the end of her rant I was rolling my eyes can coming back to look at Jennifer Fallons blog for a bit of intelligent dialogue.

JK Rowling got bloody lucky and managed to target an audience that had been largely ignored by authors for a long long time and she came out a winner, and I know she has just brought out a new book, but really its going to be much of the same thing. And people WILL keep reading her, and thats a good thing.

But I went into Galaxy Books yesterday to get myself a book to read on the bus, and there were fathers with daughters in tow perusing the aisles carrying multiple books; the cashiers were debating character development in one authors series and I was in heaven. Telling myself I could only buy one book, I spent long minutes dithering over the latest Janny Wurts or the most recent Brent Weeks and once I made my mind up, I told myself that this is OK because I can go back next week to get the other one.

Galaxy was voted the best specialty bookstore in NSW for 2008 - and if the epic fantasy audience was dying away they would be packing books away instead of putting more on the shelves!

And look, think of this, if people are patient enough to wait for George RR Martin to get off his bum and get on with the next book in his series - and wait up to ten years between books - epic fantasy has a broad, loyal and very passionate fan base.

Right, thats my rant over for the day heh heh heh

I'm not suggesting it's dying, Lisa. I'm suggesting we live in a world dictated to by the lowest common demoninator, which is why many fantasy writers still have their day jobs, while Meyer and Rowling are squllionaires.

For every epic fantasy fan with a deep and abiding passion for the genre, there are 300 squeeing teenagers looking for the next Twilight.

If I was a publisher who had to answer to my shareholders, I know what I'd want to report to my AGM, and it's not that the fans are happy. It's that the squeeing teenagers are mine, all mine...muwahahahahaha...

Might I also add, that the people waiting for George RR Martin to get off his bum are mostly over 16, and were sucked in to his series years ago, when Epic Fantasy was the in thing. They are the loyal fans I mentioned, who will - god bless 'em - keep their favourite authors in the manner to which they have become accustomed.

My question, however, is how many squeeing teenage girls will put down Stephanie Meyer and think, wow, I might give Martin (or whoever - insert author's name here)a go... ?

If only some publishers and agents would find and publish some good science fiction instead of 'science fiction trying to be epic fantasy' they might sell some of it. Authors like Peter Hamilton, Alastair Reynolds and Charles Stross are doing quite well for themselves with other publishers. They didn't have names, but they do now. Why? Because their publishers and agents saw they were good and stuck with them despite the rumour that 'Science Fiction doesn't sell' being touted around for the past 10yrs.

I don't deny there some authors doing well from scifi, AShR, but none of them are new and none of them are making the sort of impact of Rowling or Meyer, which is what I was referring to. None of them are household names outside of their field.

And I have to say, I'm sure agents and publishers would publish "good science fiction" if they could find it. To quote my agent's assistant of a few years ago, after a particularly depressing day spent rejecting manuscripts: "we weep for something publishable".

I had a very similar conversation with my agent last summer, but from the science fiction side. He has no interest in paranormal romance himself, but he'd love to have some contemporary science fiction to sell. (He's Cory Doctrow's agent, and he'd like to see more like "Little Brother" from the rest of his authors.)

So it seems that fantasy is getting pulled forward to the present and science fiction is getting pulled backward (speaking temporally only, not a qualitative judgement).

Now I just have to rewrite my unsold novel and replace the spaceships with SUV's and Alpha Centauri with Clevland and I'm all set.

That's a very good way of putting, Matt.

I'm thinking of doing the same thing only in reverse.

What's the equivalent of a coach and four, do you think? A Landcruiser or a Hummer?

I get where you are coming from Jennifer, I do. But I shudder at the thought of having to appeal to the squealing masses. I mean think of it - having to write something that appeals to a group with the combined concentration span of a gnat. Ughh!! Maybe there are reasons I am a reader and not a writer hey?

It must be so disheartening to be a writer, to have ideas, characters that you lovingly create and stories to share with the world, only to have someone make a commercial decision that your creation is just not hot right now. Or likely to be hot in a couple of years. I guess the only thing to take heart from this is all those publishers who rejected JK's original Harry script because they thought it wasnt hot to trot.

Me - I will just spend hours in Galaxy revelling in the epic fantasy created for people with more than five brain cells. Sadly, I will never make you rich Jennifer, but I will honestly appreciate the stories that you write. And whilst I wish for your sake that your writing could be commercially viable for you, I hope that even if it isnt, that you continue to do it for the love of it - and because we would really like to read more :-)

Hi Jennifer, I'm curious to ask what/who/when you and your agent came up with as the peak for epic fantasy (if it's currently sliding a little)?

We didn't discuss the past, Azquim, only the future. It would be impossible to pick the peak, although George RR Martin would by my pick.

Note to Lisa. Please, don't feel sorry for me. I didn't wish to give the impression I am crying poor. I do very nicely out of epic fantasy. It absultely keeps me in the manner to which I have become accumstomed:)

I just can't afford to buy my own country. Yet.

Jennifer - when you get to the stage when you can buy your own country, if you plan on being generous with your taxes, offering a great childcare system and as many books as I can read - can I move there?

And no worries, I dont feel sorry for you - I envy your talent and the hard work you put in to create great books so therefore I cannot feel sorry for you. Besides I saw the picture of the jug you bought. Am even more jealous now!

Ah, very nice! Thank you! That series of his was pretty amazing. Very brutal. Wish he'd finish it.

>hat the people waiting for George RR Martin to get off his bum are mostly over 16, and were sucked in to his series years ago, when Epic Fantasy was the in thing.

eh, things come and go in cycles. Epic Fantasy will wax and wane, and I actually want to use your comment to illustrate why:
you're looking at this from one perspective, that of Martin fans hitting his series with epic Fantasy being at its peak. But, there's also a lot of people like me (trust me, there are a lot of us) who were completely burned and disillusioned by Epic Fantasy regurgitating the same old same old (compare it to the hot trend of the moment, which is UF romance or Horror post-King in the 80's) and had basically given up on the genre until Song of Ice and Fire came along.
Geroge Martin brought fans like us <i>back</i> to Epic Fantasy.

Martin restored my faith, as it were,in the epics and because of that I'm more willing to try out the new blood like Brandon Sanderson.
Actually, the entry of new blood is what's probably going to bring back more readers to the Epics. For too long it was just the same names re-writing the same series.
Sanderson I keep hearing good things about. Pat Rothfuss pretty much exploded onto the scene with his first book. His sales are good.
The epics have been with us since Gilgamesh and Odyssey, they're not going anywhere. They'll wax and wane, but they'll stay.

But I was over 16 when I read Martin, so that's a fair point.

Now, speaking of sales and all -- there are levels of sales. Rowling, Meyer, King, Grisham, etc: these are superstar level of sales.
There's a reason their names are recognizable even to people outside their genres. It's a whole different level of booksale.
I'm not so sure you can compare the average writer to the superstars and say "this or that genre is doing badly, or in decline". The superstars, like King, are brands unto themselves.

Why one person becomes a superstar and another doesn't is a mystery I don't think anyone will ever solve. Luck of the zeitgeist, probably.

To me, that's a different discussion than how well or badly a specific genre is doing.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, even if I'm disagreeing with some of it, it's an interesting conversation always.

Sometimes I feel like the last fan of epic fantasy. At least of what I call "traditional" epic fantasy. While epic fantasy seems to be doing ok, more and more of it is the "dark, gritty" stuff. I do like those stories (Abercrombie, Ruckley, Martin), but it seems the "tradtional" stuff with elves, dwarves, etc is ridiculed nowadays (which has led to 2 rants on my blog). You almost have to look a the YA genre for these books now.

On a semi-related note, I guess I will have to import your latest series from your home country. I dont want to wait 3 years for the US releases, and it sounds like Book Depository won't work either. Looks like I need to check into the exchange rates for australia.

How cool to see two completely different POV's in David and Jeff. Which I think pretty much tells us that there is always going to be a market for the genre and all the shades of fantasy that live within it.

I do agree with David in the sense that George RR Martin revitalised the genre in that his characters are so complex - he was so ready to throw great characters on the fire and destroy them and where the line between good and bad is so very thin that at some point you find yourself cheering for a character you loathed for such a long time.

Jennifer did the same thing in the Time Lord Series - I didnt know whether to adore or despise Cayal and there was something curiously attractive about Jaxon. Its the twists and turns that make it addictive.

I havent tried Sanderson or Rothfuss yet, but maybe it will be worthwhile reading them whilst I am waiting for Ms Fallon to bring out a new series :-)

Note to Jeff - I still love elves, dwarves and orcs. LoTR takes pride of place in my bookshelf and has since I was in my early teens and they have been read, read and re-read a million times. Now I am waiting for my oldest child to reach an age where I can hand her The Hobbit and introduce her to a whole new world. There is nothing wrong with being a traditional fantasy fan :-)

This is becoming a fascinating discussion.I absolutely agree with you David, that many fans were burned and disillusioned by Epic Fantasy regurgitating the same old same old and had basically given up on the genre until Song of Ice and Fire came along.

The discussion with my agent was all about those names that sit in the stratophere of sales. We were speculating on what sets them apart from the rest of us.

I guess what prompted my suggestion the genre is on the wane is that despite legions of fans out there who devour epic fantasy completely, my agent and I agreed the Next Big Thing is unlikely to be an epic fantasy.

Wish I knew what it was, btw. I wouldn't mind owning my own country.

ok, I will agree that the Next Big Thing is unlikely to be epic fantasy. Mind you, as fun as it is to speculate on, chasing something like that is a bit like chasing El Dorado. Never gonna get there.

Jeff: I still like traditional epic fantasy too. The darker, grittier style of Martin was very refreshing and even more appealing to me, but I don't want to see elves and dragons and orcs be phased out. They were there when I started reading the genre, a big part of what I loved about it.

I will always love epic fantasy and have no desire to read "the next best thing"...

I will always love it too, Bron.

I will only continue to write it, however, while I believe I'm bringing something to genre, not just rehashing the same old same old. (even if I'm the only one that thinks so).

That said, I would not be averse to writing the NBT. (See previous entries about wanting to own my own country...hehehe)

Epic fantasy I see as the hardcore, its what fans who have read the 'next big thing' move onto. I started reading fantasy when I was 14, I picked up a dragonlance novel in english class and my love developed from there. Im not a fan of harry potter or have I read the Twilight series, but I see them as doorways to the great fantasy out there. If I never read dragonlance and fell in love, I never would have moved onto Feist, Gemell, Martin and Fallon.

I came quite late to fantasy. I think I was well into my thirties and I started with David Eddings. Sort of snowballed from there. Before that I was a big sci-fi fan. Still am for the classic stuff. Not so much a fan of some more recent hardcore "science" sc-fi, where the ideas becomes more important than the characters. I like ideas, but I'm more interested in their consequences on individuals than ideas for ideas' sake.

which is why we love your characters so much, I reckon!

I think most of us fell into fantasy as teenagers, and I like what Andrew says about the currently popular things as being doorways into epic fantasy. Therefore we would have to hope that new readers do find their way to new and established authors in EF.

Apart from that, I really dont know of any other genre that allows an author to create really complex and detailed stories. If you are Stephen King (for example) every book you write is a stand alone book and has no (or very little) link to others. But if you are Jennifer Fallon, you can dive right into a storyline that is far more complicated, and with a larger, more diverse character list. And you keep your audience for a much longer time. And thats a good thing :-)

I believe what Andrew has said, that "the next big thing" making readers want to read more epic fantasy. I would never touch a book until I have to say I got one the Harry Potter band wagon ;). After that I went searching for something else to read and found David Eddings and I couldnt stop there. Working in a bookstore for 5 years, I have seen what people are looking for. Mothers that want their teenagers to read more were looking at epic fantasy books and people like me who couldnt stop reading were the same.

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